I'm a bit disappointed by this. Yeah, it's a bit funny, but it's also a bit snarky to suggest that the car burnings in France really have anything to do with socialism. After all, these are the actions of only a few hundred idiots in a country of over sixty million people.
MethinksMay 8, 2007 at 10:25 pm
David,
except for one little fact: on a "normal" Saturday night, about 100 cars are torched in France (source: AP).
Riots, where private property is routinely destroyed, are pretty common in France to – certainly more common than in any other European country.
Mr. Graf,
Let us see if the logic tracks?
France has an election between two candidates, one socialist and the other conservative. The conservative won. There are immediate riots, burning, and destruction of private property of people who had absolutely nothing to do with either candidate, just random violence and destruction.
Is it logical to assume that the rioting and destruction is being done by supporters of the conservative? Well, no it isn't. That would just not make any sense at all.
Is it logical to assume the rioting and destruction was carried out by the supporters of the losing socialist, an expression of anger that democracy left them on the outside? Well, yes it is. Snarky? You are living in a world of delusion, sir.
This just reminds us that the ones who speak most passionately and fervently about the glories of democracy are the ones who react most violently and destructively when democracy goes against them. It isn't democracy that the left loves and wants, it is winning that they want. Anything less is cause for force to impose their views.
Mathieu BédardMay 9, 2007 at 7:47 am
Considering the LCR (Revolutionnary communist league)called for 'social resistance', and the many french anarcho-communist groups called for their members to be "ungovernable", yeah, I guess 'socialist' is the right word.
I wouldn't call Sarkozy free-market though.; his program was almost identical to the socialist's… Maybe a little more market friendly? Maybe a little more reasonable? But he's definitely not a classical liberal.
MethinksMay 9, 2007 at 8:12 am
"I wouldn't call Sarkozy free-market though.."
True
A friend who grew up in Paris put it this way: "Sarkozy makes Hillary Clinton seem like Ayn Rand."
David P. GrafMay 9, 2007 at 8:42 am
Vidyohs,
Considering that the socialist got 47% of the vote and all we're talking about are the actions of a few hundred jerks, I think it's silly to use that to conclude anything about socialism. Besides, Sarkozy came down hard on immigration. For all we know, the car burnings are in anger over that and have nothing to do with socialism.
Let me put it another way – when the Bulls won a championship, there was property destruction by some bums. Do you think that says anything in general about Bulls fans?
Mathieu BédardMay 9, 2007 at 9:07 am
No, I think the destruction and burning of cars and the riots is the direct effect of the socialist's strategy to demonize Nicolas Sarkozy, calling him a fascist, a danger for every immigrant, "a dangerous man that would be the first, since 1944, to apply the extreme right wing theories", a eugenicists, etc etc. They even had a slanderous mailing list going on where they claimed Sarkozy's grand parents back in Hungary were strong supporters of the Nazi regime during the 30s (they were jewish for god's sake…)
Also, the reported fact that the rioters were signing songs like "Sarko! Fascist! We'll have your head!" kinda makes you believe it has indeed to do with the left being unhappy about the new president…
I love this line: "Critics on the left assailed him for his high-budget retreat — the yacht belongs to prominent magnate Vincent Bollore and was outfitted with huge plasma TVs and a jacuzzi."
Would would they expect to find on a yacht?
ObjectivistMay 9, 2007 at 10:43 am
Sarkozy is good for France. He has promised to abolish the ridiculous 35-hour week, cut the top rate from 60% to 50%, and to make employment more flexible, as well as eliminate the French wealth tax of 1.5% on successful businessmen. All Royal wanted to do was loot the public treasury to create a few hundred thousand fake jobs, like public works without cause, and raise the minimum wage (already over $10 an hour), so even more youth could be unemployed! Despite the rioting and crap from the French left, its good to see that the French people had the guts in this election to look at the system, see the holes in it, and vote for someone who would take steps to fix it.
David P. GrafMay 9, 2007 at 11:43 pm
Matt C. – Royal said that there would be violence, but it would be caused by the polarization of Sarkozy's campaign. Of course, one could make the case that the kettle is calling the pot black, but why bother.
Again, if anyone really thinks that the idiot actions of a few define the majority of people who hold a political philosophy, then continue to think so.
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{ 15 comments }
I'm a bit disappointed by this. Yeah, it's a bit funny, but it's also a bit snarky to suggest that the car burnings in France really have anything to do with socialism. After all, these are the actions of only a few hundred idiots in a country of over sixty million people.
David,
except for one little fact: on a "normal" Saturday night, about 100 cars are torched in France (source: AP).
Riots, where private property is routinely destroyed, are pretty common in France to – certainly more common than in any other European country.
It reminds me of a part of a King Missle song "It's Saturday":
Maybe Socialists also appeal to anti-Semites…
Mr. Graf,
Let us see if the logic tracks?
France has an election between two candidates, one socialist and the other conservative. The conservative won. There are immediate riots, burning, and destruction of private property of people who had absolutely nothing to do with either candidate, just random violence and destruction.
Is it logical to assume that the rioting and destruction is being done by supporters of the conservative? Well, no it isn't. That would just not make any sense at all.
Is it logical to assume the rioting and destruction was carried out by the supporters of the losing socialist, an expression of anger that democracy left them on the outside? Well, yes it is. Snarky? You are living in a world of delusion, sir.
This just reminds us that the ones who speak most passionately and fervently about the glories of democracy are the ones who react most violently and destructively when democracy goes against them. It isn't democracy that the left loves and wants, it is winning that they want. Anything less is cause for force to impose their views.
Considering the LCR (Revolutionnary communist league)called for 'social resistance', and the many french anarcho-communist groups called for their members to be "ungovernable", yeah, I guess 'socialist' is the right word.
I wouldn't call Sarkozy free-market though.; his program was almost identical to the socialist's… Maybe a little more market friendly? Maybe a little more reasonable? But he's definitely not a classical liberal.
"I wouldn't call Sarkozy free-market though.."
True
A friend who grew up in Paris put it this way: "Sarkozy makes Hillary Clinton seem like Ayn Rand."
Vidyohs,
Considering that the socialist got 47% of the vote and all we're talking about are the actions of a few hundred jerks, I think it's silly to use that to conclude anything about socialism. Besides, Sarkozy came down hard on immigration. For all we know, the car burnings are in anger over that and have nothing to do with socialism.
Let me put it another way – when the Bulls won a championship, there was property destruction by some bums. Do you think that says anything in general about Bulls fans?
No, I think the destruction and burning of cars and the riots is the direct effect of the socialist's strategy to demonize Nicolas Sarkozy, calling him a fascist, a danger for every immigrant, "a dangerous man that would be the first, since 1944, to apply the extreme right wing theories", a eugenicists, etc etc. They even had a slanderous mailing list going on where they claimed Sarkozy's grand parents back in Hungary were strong supporters of the Nazi regime during the 30s (they were jewish for god's sake…)
Also, the reported fact that the rioters were signing songs like "Sarko! Fascist! We'll have your head!" kinda makes you believe it has indeed to do with the left being unhappy about the new president…
Mathieu,
Précisément!
Hey Graf-
Then explain this statement by Royal on May 4th.
France's Royal Warns of Violence if Sarkozy Wins
I love this line: "Critics on the left assailed him for his high-budget retreat — the yacht belongs to prominent magnate Vincent Bollore and was outfitted with huge plasma TVs and a jacuzzi."
Would would they expect to find on a yacht?
Sarkozy is good for France. He has promised to abolish the ridiculous 35-hour week, cut the top rate from 60% to 50%, and to make employment more flexible, as well as eliminate the French wealth tax of 1.5% on successful businessmen. All Royal wanted to do was loot the public treasury to create a few hundred thousand fake jobs, like public works without cause, and raise the minimum wage (already over $10 an hour), so even more youth could be unemployed! Despite the rioting and crap from the French left, its good to see that the French people had the guts in this election to look at the system, see the holes in it, and vote for someone who would take steps to fix it.
Matt C. – Royal said that there would be violence, but it would be caused by the polarization of Sarkozy's campaign. Of course, one could make the case that the kettle is calling the pot black, but why bother.
Again, if anyone really thinks that the idiot actions of a few define the majority of people who hold a political philosophy, then continue to think so.
Except that Ayn Rand had better cheekbones.