A Voice Consistently Powerful and Liberal

Viking: I would agree that there is room for both id and intellect, but they rarely seem to share it. One generally does not hear "Oh snap! You done been TOLD!" during intellectual discussion, and it is fairly rare for someone to truely eviscerate an argument logically while keeping an audience interested.

However, it can happen, which is why I am so fond of EconTalk, as well as enjoying Penn & Teller's show, though the latter slips into mere straw men periodically. I can't bring myself to watch much other programming that pretends to be intellectual.

"we often want to see our heroes smite those we dislike. Sort of a visceral need."

That pretty much sums it up for me. I like a good circus.

"rarely leads to excellent discussion and insight"

There's plenty of room for both id and intellect.

"The Right tries, but seems to fail pretty generally."

I'd say that the Left has perfected the art of attacking the arguer rather than the argument (Olbermann's Worst Person in the World), while the Right is more likely to engage in straw man tactics (anything that comes out of Hannity's mouth).

I think part of the issue with "good tv" is that we often want to see our heroes smite those we dislike. Sort of a visceral need. The trouble is that this, while often satisfying, rarely leads to excellent discussion and insight.

Consider how many times we have asked Don or Russ to really lay into some poster or article and put the proper smack down on them.

I might go so far as to say the American Left has made an artform of this sort of circus, leveraging the "us vs. them" aspect for each of their power groups in general. The Right tries, but seems to fail pretty generally.

For some reason, this line of thought makes me want to go watch "Team America: World Police" :-P

Glenn Beck is a clown and an idiot. Anyone associating with his act has, at the very least, poor judgment.

I think Levin is the worst, which is sad because he is probably the most intelligent and best educated of the bunch. Whenever someone disagrees with him, he just gets personal and insults the person. It's pretty juvenile, and nowhere near intellectually honest debate.

Don't care much for Beck, and most of the rest. Limbaugh's in a different league entirely and is very entertaining. The pompous loudmouth stuff is just for fun, part of the shtick. Hannity, Levin et al make me switch to FM most days.

Speaking of shows...

Cavuto on Fox Business is one of my favorites. I just finished watching today's show. Jonathan Hoenig of Capitalist Pig (my favorite FB guest) said two things that sounded like they were lifted word-for-word from Cafe Hayek. I know we're all of a similar mind, but it makes me wonder if he's a lurker.

You there, Jonathan?

"He reasoned through things, eschewed the histrionics and egomania, and treated his guests, even ones with whom he disagreed, with respect."

You make a good point distinguishing the elements of a good show from wise ideas. If I am to isolate myself from everything with which I strongly disagree, life would be pretty dull and lonely. No more talk shows. No more movies. No more TV. Almost no new books. No newspapers. Few magazines. Quit my job. Lose my friends.

A show can be interesting and still nearly devoid of good ideas, especially if the humor is clever. I've had belly laughs from both Maher and Limbaugh, while clearly they defend (and often not very well) different points of view. And this is not because I'm a moderate or trying to be open-minded. They both just occasionally have very good comic technique.

Viking:

You mention Jerry Springer. He actually had a (short-lived) radio show on Air America a few years back. While I disagreed with his leftist worldview, believe it or not it actually was a very good radio show. He reasoned through things, eschewed the histrionics and egomania, and treated his guests, even ones with whom he disagreed, with respect.

And, you see where that gets you in terms of talk show popularity...

"that is very brave of you"

Well, I am a Viking after all.

viking - that is very brave of you to admit you listen/watch those clowns.

Crusader--

I much prefer the EconTalk style and content, but I'd be lying if I told you I did not repeatedly listen to all of those you mentioned.

Limbaugh has some pretty funny satire. Beck is occasionally interesting. With Maher, there is something circus maximus about watching Maxine Waters or some celebrity unknowingly embarrass themselves in front of an applauding encouraging audience. It's a similar spectacle with Jerry Springer I suppose, but it only interests me when it's someone famous--particularly when it's a politician.

Yeah, there's a bit of the rabble in me. But TV/radio is a pretty harmless outlet for it.

viking - it speaks volumes about America that loudmouths like Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and Bill Maher get all the ratings.

Glenn Beck's commentary is interesting enough, but his histrionics are hard to stomach.

Glenn Beck is a hack in the Huey Long mold.

Glenn Beck is puzzling. Glenn exhibits some libertarian streaks every now and then. Ever since he moved to fox, his ratings have gone through the roof. I have heard that his program is the second most watched program, after that of the fascist named O'Reilly. If he sustains his popularity, he is likely to soon move his program to prime time replacing either Shep Smith or Hannity.

I look forward to seeing this episode. Though I share some of Beck's concerns, his antics are a little bit too over the top for me.

Glenn Beck Is on Fox at 3pm mountain time

Didn't Beck move to Fox?